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Daymokh : Interview with Umar Khanbiyev Chechen envoy slams "round table" proposal to end war BBC Monitoring Service - United Kingdom, Feb 03, 2005 An exclusive interview with the health minister of the Chechen Republic of Ichkeria and the general representative of the general representative of the CRI president abroad, Umar Khanbiyev, to the Daymohk news agency. [This is only a partial extract from the interview - for the complete interview translated in english see: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/chechnya-sl/message/43041] PACE session [Correspondent] You were at the PACE session last year. It was interesting in the sense that the consequences of its decisions have already been felt in the form of a kind of "round table meeting". Tell us what happened. [Khanbiyev] At the PACE session last autumn the Chechen delegation, which was represented by S.Beshayev, A.Idigov, A.Saiyeva, S.-Kh.Abumuslimov and A.Bisultanov, worked with groups of MPs from various European countries and PACE's rapporteurs on Chechnya. The situation was very complex for us. Russia cynically and brazenly put pressure on the European MPs, speculating on the tragic events in Beslan. A meeting of PACE's political committee, which was held in Switzerland, according to our information, set out the following line to all the committees and national parliaments: "To reconsider their loyal attitude to the legitimate power of the CRI and recognition of the Chechen puppet authority". To this end a delegation of Chechen puppets, headed by the latter-day actor [Alu] Alkhanov, playing the role of "Chechen president" was urgently invited to Strasbourg. Russia's "friends" pulled out all the stops to create a "presidential image" for this Kremlin puppet. But, as they say, "a leopard does not change its spots". To a question by the German MP Rudolf Bindig on his attitude to Kadyrov's bands, the ill-starred puppet Alkhanov was unable to say anything sensible other than that these bands were "very useful". The former PACE president, the British Russell Johnson, who now heads a liberal group of MPs, stated openly at the PACE session that they "recognize Aslan Maskhadov as Chechnya's legitimate president, as a president elected by the people, which cannot be said about the man who is at present". This was the moment when Russia's efforts to legitimate its new puppet collapsed hopelessly, although the Russian officials engaged in wishful thinking through the media. [Correspondent] One seems to recall that the Russian side was very satisfied with the results of that PACE session. How can one explain why they were as happy as a cat with cream? [Khanbiyev] Unfortunately, the situation at PACE is not as simple as it seems from the outside. At the time the Russian side was able to brainwash the majority of the MPs from the national parliaments of the European Union, mainly those from the former Soviet Union. PACE, in essence, has become the headquarters of the United Russia party. The great Dzhokhar Dudayev was right when, answering a question about the prospects of Russia's joining the EU, he said literally the following: "The EU will become Russia's internal affair." This is evident today. You may have noticed that every more or less significant EU official, once he is appointed, hurries to show his respect for the Russian regime. Otherwise, however loathsome one describes the behaviour of the PACE, which appointed one [Mikhail] Margelov, the odious defender of the genocide of the Chechens by the Kremlin regime, who now calls himself a representative of the Russian State Duma and head of the Democrats of Europe faction. If he personifies the democrats of Europe, then one may boldly state the words of the well-known ice-hockey commentator [Nikolay] Ozerov: "We can do without that kind of ice hockey!" Many of our friends are unanimous in the view that the Kremlin regime is operating in its domestic policy according to the formula of Saddam Hussain - "Oil in exchange for the support of the genocide of the Chechens". Gross' "round table" proposal And the "delusion" of one of the special rapporteurs on Chechnya, the Swiss Andreas Gross was reinforced by such processes in PACE. He began his report by saying that one should act with understanding towards Russia and consider its aggrieved and painful sense of loss of the colonial countries of the Baltic. Although Gross' report also contained fierce criticism of Russia over the situation in Chechnya, like a character from Ilf and Petrov he, "blushing with shame", continued to insist that the plunderer should not be criticized for the destruction of the Chechens, but pitied - so that the "beast" does not become mentally deranged. What is more, Gross is recommending a "round table meeting" to seek "ways out of the war", in which he stipulates in advance that "only those who recognise Russia's integrity and do not adopt terrorist methods for political aims should sit at this table". It follows from this that if we do not recognise the CRI as a part of Russia and refuse to take part in this farce, then we automatically become terrorists. Although we were angered by his gibberish, we decided to talk calmly with him. I personally, as a doctor, wanted to convince myself of the state of his mental health. A very tactical from our point of view conversation with Gross was disrupted after four or five minutes because of his quite unprovoked aggressive behaviour. And I got the impression that this was a perfectly coordinated solo episode from a script written by a Chechen author behind the scenes. It was difficult not to detect the hypocrisy in the European's game in this comedy on a Chechen theme. We already have plenty of experience of "round table meetings" which basically serve not the establishment of peace, but are an illusion of talks engineered to give Russia more time for its genocidal war in Chechnya. To our harmless remarks that by such a "round table meeting" Lord Judd had already been "establishing peace in Chechnya", and whether it was wise to repeat these same mistakes, which had been publicly and honestly admitted by Judd himself, the author of the "round table meeting" Gross leapt up as though he had scalded himself and cried: "Mr Khanbiyev, are you prepared to put up three to four people from your side for a "round table meeting?"! "Wait a minute," I said, "we still need to understand what kind of "meeting" this is. You have not answered our questions, perhaps we can find some kind of compromise?" "If you do not agree, then I will find Chechens who will sit at this "meeting"! And Zakayev has already given his consent to take part in a 'round table'!" Gross thundered as he walked out. Cut! Right there where, apparently, the dog of Gross the actor is buried! According to the script of the writer who wrote this for Gross, I should have run after him and begged his forgiveness, pleading that he include us in his list of "round table" participants. It is perfectly possible that the author of the script, about whom one can only guess, some time here in Strasbourg, behaved in precisely the same way in relation to his colleagues, mimicking stormy political activity. Of course, Gross was lying and had not obtained nor could have obtained any consent by Akhmed Zakayev to take part, which Zakayev himself later refuted in a statement. We calmly wished Gross "success" in his quest for such "Chechens" who are prepared to sell their people for thirty pieces of silver. I have deliberately dwelt in detail on this episode to show clearly how our enemies try to use the rumours about disagreements which allegedly exist in the ranks of Chechen politicians working abroad. And that's all. Attempt at "Chechenization" of war [Correspondent] What eventually happened to this "round table meeting" and who will be taking part in it? Are you confident that deputies of the CRI will not be there? [Khanbiyev] The joint delegation of the government and parliament of the CRI, which took part in the work of the PACE's autumn session, categorically condemned Andreas Gross' attempt to make a pretence of a "talks process" with an obviously hopeless outcome, which serves for Russia as a pretext to continue the war without criticism from the EU. In essence, a "round table meeting" is an attempt to "Chechenize" the Russian-Chechen war, in other words an attempt by PACE to help Russia in what it, basically, has been trying to achieve through all the long years of the war. We passed on our proposals to PACE's political committee. To be brief, they boil down to the fact that a "round table meeting" in such a form is a sham for approval, as though PACE was engaged in a "political settlement" to the Russian-Chechen war, and that we see them as a departure from a constructive position to seek real political talks between the warring sides. Such farces, as we have already been convinced more than once, will have no realistic effect on the progress of the still continuing war. Only realistic talks between the CRI and Russian presidents, with the participation of a third party, can stop the Russian-Chechen war. At the initial stage the EU and PACE would be able to take upon the role of the third party, if, of course, they could rid themselves of the role of Russia's servants. [passage omitted: more on this] All that is known at the moment is that a "round table" meeting will be held in Moscow, and a band of national traitors with their leader Alkhanov (of course, if he has not by then be blown up like his predecessor: the time of such national traitors is usually brief), will be presented as the "Chechen side". Gross himself concocted the mythical "Ichkerian side", which he himself delegated. No-one knows who will be in it. I do not trust those lists which have been published recently. I am sure that the names of "Gross' Ichkerians" will not be on it and they will remain a secret. Gross, like a true card sharper, holds the "trump cards" up his sleeve. It is just like in the proverb: "We are being married but we don't know who to ". Even Gross' colleagues are surprised by his metamorphosis, although, and this is surprising here, as they say: "He who keeps company with the wolf will learn how to howl". Gross' friendly contacts with the Russian regime were not in vain. And the Russian side back home in Moscow will continue to act out a "political settlement" in Chechnya with this card sharper. Whether Tutakov's "Strasbourg inmates" will be there is still not known for certain. But, bearing in mind fact that Andreas Gross, the author of the "round table meeting", and Alvaro Hill-Robles, the EU commissar, on the Russian side's recommendation, has held several talks with the guides of the "Strasbourg tourist crusade", one may imagine that these "deputies" have been prepared for just such a "round table meeting". Gross' confidence in his success in the quest for "Chechens" who will sit down not only at his "round table", but also anywhere you like, "round or not", it seems, was not so unfounded when you consider that among the "deputies" were "elected representatives of the people", who have already sat down on Yastrzhembskiy's toilet seat in the Kremlin. I don't know how some "deputies" will continue to behave, I cannot answer for them, but the fact remains that the "secret Strasbourg mission" failed before it even began. Although, what is the difference here? If a man has followed the path of betraying the interests of his own people, then you won't stop him by persuasion. [passage omitted: Khanbiyev declines to speculate as to who will represent the Chechen side at a Moscow round table meeting] Source: Daymohk news agency web site, in Russian 1 Feb 05 http://www.daymohk.info/cgi-bin/orsi3/index.cgi?id=11246;section=1#11246